Again people died at a festival

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Remco
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Again people died at a festival -
18 August 2011, at 21:37
3 people died and 71 people wounded (11 heavy wounded) at Belgian festival Pukkelpop after heavy storm.

The festival was supposed to be held today and the next 2 days, but is now stopped. One of the victims died on the festival ground, the other 2 at a camping next to it.

Suddenly it got dark and heavy wind arrived. "It was a chaos. Constructions and part of tents were blown away."

During the heavy storm, some constructions were blown away, like a tower and a tent near a podium. Big parts of the festival had floods of water. A tree fell on a food tent. The festival is stopped.

The 3-days festival near Hasselt has yearly 60,000 visitors and started today (Thursday)

http://nieuws.nl.msn.com/gallery-section/drie-doden-door-noodweer-op-pukkelpop

Unbelievale. Again.

R.I.P.
Kevin
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# 19 August 2011, at 09:52
I guess this topic deserves a small update. The Belgian people are really shocked about this.

At the moment, 5 people died and there are 10 heavy wounded people from which 3 of them are still critical. There are about 140 light wounded people. The organizers have decided to cancel the remaining 2 days out of respect of the victims and their family.

R.I.P.

source
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Last edited on 19 August 2011, at 09:54
R33
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# 19 August 2011, at 20:45
My goodness. Those poor poor people and their families. RIP to the deceased.

When will people just listen to the weather for crying out loud‽
DJRANZ
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# 20 August 2011, at 05:42
Originally posted by R33
My goodness. Those poor poor people and their families. RIP to the deceased.

When will people just listen to the weather for crying out loud‽


To further back this up, event planners and runners need to heed weather warnings, or if they can't or won't cancel the event, at the very least, MAKE SURE the arena and stage are up to safety codes and regulations. Incidents like this are fatal and can result in a loss of confidence from the patrons.

My condolences to those affected.
Now known as Randy Derricott. I may sometimes use the DJ Ranz alias for certain projects though.

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Last edited on 20 August 2011, at 05:43
Remco
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# 20 August 2011, at 07:29
The event organizers stated that there were no warnings for storms send out.

The KMI (Belgian weather reports) said on the other hand that they did send out a weather warning in the morning that a heavy storm was coming.

People at the festival said they the event organizers have said that people didn't have to worry about the storm that was coming up.

This should be very easy to check. Looks like the event organizers have once again ignored a weather warning. The blood of 5 dead people are on their hands!
Kevin
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# 20 August 2011, at 09:47
Guys, I'm following the national news closely about this and nobody here points their fingers to the KMI nor to the organizers. It's just a tragic accident and it is nobodies fault. It all happened in about 10 minutes and it could not be foreseen. Even with the most modern technology, things like this can not be predicted: too local event in a too small period of time.

We do care about all the victims in our mind!
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Last edited on 20 August 2011, at 09:48
Remco
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# 20 August 2011, at 12:29
Except for that it was predicted and could be foreseen. The KMI send out a weather warning in the morning. The level was changed to code orange, which means danger. This festival should not have started.

In Holland we had the same some weeks ago. A festival at the beach was cancelled due to heavy winds, which were predicted. Some visitors were pissed off, but at least nobody died.

And that is exactly what should've happened here. The organizers ARE to blame here. The visitors were appearently worried and they had all the right to be. With knowing better, they told the visitors there's nothing to worry about. And with what happened in America last week, they should've been more carefull. They had the perfect example of what could happen. Yet, they completely ignored it.

The thing they probably cared most about was that it would cost a lot of money....
Kevin
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# 20 August 2011, at 13:05
Originally posted by Remco
Except for that it was predicted and could be foreseen. The KMI send out a weather warning in the morning. The level was changed to code orange, which means danger. This festival should not have started.

In Holland we had the same some weeks ago. A festival at the beach was cancelled due to heavy winds, which were predicted. Some visitors were pissed off, but at least nobody died.

And that is exactly what should've happened here. The organizers ARE to blame here. The visitors were appearently worried and they had all the right to be. With knowing better, they told the visitors there's nothing to worry about. And with what happened in America last week, they should've been more carefull. They had the perfect example of what could happen. Yet, they completely ignored it.

The thing they probably cared most about was that it would cost a lot of money....


After reading this article, I understand why we do share different opinions. I won't give any further comments regarding this topic.
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Remco
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# 20 August 2011, at 17:42
So what I understand from this article is that the Belgians defend the organization, simply because it's the Dutch that criticizes it. The stupidest reason ever!!

The fact stands that the KMI has given a warning and the organization ignored it. And not only ignored it. But told the visitors not to worry when they were already worried for a reason.

What I also think is disgusting is that the organization even wanted the festival to continue the next 2 days right after it happened.

Really, the organization is to blame in every way. And every Belgian knows it. They just don't want to admit it, cz that would mean the Dutch are right. Must be Belgian logic :p
Kevin
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# 20 August 2011, at 19:17
Originally posted by Remco
So what I understand from this article is that the Belgians defend the organization, simply because it's the Dutch that criticizes it. The stupidest reason ever!!

The fact stands that the KMI has given a warning and the organization ignored it. And not only ignored it. But told the visitors not to worry when they were already worried for a reason.

What I also think is disgusting is that the organization even wanted the festival to continue the next 2 days right after it happened.

Really, the organization is to blame in every way. And every Belgian knows it. They just don't want to admit it, cz that would mean the Dutch are right. Must be Belgian logic :p


If the facts are like you say, then the organizers are indeed to blame, no matter what logic is used :p

The point is that none of the Belgian press organizations report these facts. We don't know where they come from? The article is even suggerating that the Dutch invented these facts. At least we are not aware that the KMI has given such a warning to the organisators in a direct way. Anyway, if it was true, there is no way that the organizers could talk their way out of this.

Second, it doesn't really matter if they decided to cancel the festival just after the accident or before the start of the second day. The result is the same: the festival is cancelled for the remaining days. Keep in mind that many of the festival visitors weren't really aware of what has happened. That would have led to unnecessary panic with additional unnecessary consequences. At the time of the accident, there were more important things to do then informing the visitors of the cancellation.

Third, the national TV news even ignores the fact that the Dutch are blaming the organizers. :p I wasn't aware of this too until I saw your version of the facts which leaded me to investigate the Dutch news reports.
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Last edited on 20 August 2011, at 19:20
Remco
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# 20 August 2011, at 22:26
Well maybe the Belgian TV didn't want the Dutch to be right, so they completely ignored it :p

I don't know why they do it, but these stories are coming from the Dutch people that attended that festival. The Belgian attenders must have expeirenced the same. Somehow it seems that they want to keep that out of the Belgian news.

And even if the KMI hadn't send out a warning. A storm of this shape doesn't start in a split second. They still should've known it in advance and they could've at least started with clearing the area. With a good organization, 60,000 people can be cleared from a festival within an hour.

The visitors needed to be informed, they didn't inform them about anything. Now that is leading to more chaos and panic. And no there aren't more important things than that, cz it's a prevention of panic, therefor more incidents. Providing information is top priority when there's panic. And it's not that they didn't have more important things to do, cz they thought of it and decided to continue. No matter if they decided later to cancel it and the outcome is the same, they should've done it immediately. Who wants to party at a festival where people died?

Huge mistakes have been made, like last week, and it will be proven during the next few weeks. These organizers should not be able to organize an event ever again.
Remco
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# 22 August 2011, at 08:47
It turns out a miscalculation has been made. Not 5 people have died at the festival, but 4. They also included somebody who died as well, but who had nothing to do with the festival.
vera
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# 22 August 2011, at 09:18
This is very sad, i hate it how every summer smth like this just MUST happen :(.
RIP :(

p.s Remco and Kevin, maybe you 2 could start a topic, Dutch vs Belgian? :p
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Remco
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# 22 August 2011, at 09:41
Originally posted by vera
This is very sad, i hate it how every summer smth like this just MUST happen :(.
RIP :(

Yes, I saw vids on the Dutch news from inside the tent that collapsed and everybody was screaming. Really horrifying.

Here's a vid from outside that tent:


Originally posted by vera
p.s Remco and Kevin, maybe you 2 could start a topic, Dutch vs Belgian? :p

Hahaha ye, it probably sounds like I'm criticizing the Belgians cz it's the Belgians and sometimes it's easy to make jokes about them, but this isn't something to joke about. I think the same of the organization in the US from last week and I'm glad nothing happened at Lowlands here, cz there was also a weather alarm here on Saturday. But it turned out the weather wasn't that bad after all.
Last edited on 22 August 2011, at 09:42
Kevin
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# 22 August 2011, at 12:12
Originally posted by Remco

Hahaha ye, it probably sounds like I'm criticizing the Belgians cz it's the Belgians and sometimes it's easy to make jokes about them, but this isn't something to joke about. I think the same of the organization in the US from last week and I'm glad nothing happened at Lowlands here, cz there was also a weather alarm here on Saturday. But it turned out the weather wasn't that bad after all.


It's true that the Dutch makes jokes about the Belgians as do the Belgians with the Dutch. Anyway, I wan't to make it clear that it just stays with joking and none of them have hard feelings against the other. It's probably just because we're somehow related due the usage of the same language (at least 50% of the Belgian's speak Dutch :p ) or so...

Originally posted by vera

p.s Remco and Kevin, maybe you 2 could start a topic, Dutch vs Belgian? :p


It does'nt make much sense to do that here since we already do that all the time :D Also, me and Remco are probably the only Belgian respectively Dutch active members around here, so that wouldn't be much fun :p

Finally, I want to stress again that me as any other Belgian consider this as a tragic accident for which no one can be blamed. I'm glad that less people have died then earlier reported. I don't really understand how something like this can be 'miscalculated' :blush: So if Remco wants to make comments about that, shoot!

PS: I've heard that something similar has happened in Madrid too. No one died but there were wounded people.
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Last edited on 22 August 2011, at 12:38
Kevin
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# 24 August 2011, at 17:46

Update:

Yesterday, a person which was heavily wounded died. So far, 5 people have died due to the tragic accident at Pukkelpop. There are still 7 people under critical conditions.

Source (in dutch)
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